Found this piece, interesting voter statistics ...... Cons won't like it though
Iteresting in that the voter stats in the Western Provinces show that
the majority do not like the Conservatives??????? This Kind of
makes my thoughts on a Centralist Libertarian Conservative NDP Party
seem more credable?
cheers :) majere
snipped>
Sun May 29 2005
By DALE SWIRSKY
NOT since the deadlocked sectarian divisions of the 1860s have Canadians faced a political situation as unhealthy as the current one.
In short, we have a government we do not want, and opposition parties that we want even less.
Without question, the Liberals merit punishment at the polls. They have not paid for their sins, and continue to sin by operating in the belief that power can be purchased.
But while Canadians are painfully aware that the Liberals are damaging Canada, they fear the two main opposition groups would harm it even more. Canadians are showing great restraint and wisdom in not punishing Canada (ie. themselves) for Liberal transgressions. History is filled with societies which, in the understandable desire to toss out incompetent governments, turned to worse alternatives, with predictably sad consequences.
The NDP has acquitted itself well in the current "rage TV" parliamentary session. It avoided mudslinging and negotiated more resources for the homeless, post-secondary education, and the environment. Critics howled about a "drunken-sailor spending spree", but the reality is that most Canadians support these measures, and the cost is a mere 0.45 per cent of the budget -- the equivalent of my wife and I spending $13.50 more than our usual $3,000 in monthly expenses. If drunken sailors (who are not to be confused with my wife and I) spent more helping the homeless, education and the environment, what a wonderful world it would be!
Still, while the NDP deserves credit for working to have Parliament work, its anti-business and anti-American tendencies cause many Canadians to eschew it as a potential government. That so many Canadians would never consider voting NDP helps maintain Liberal power. The Conservatives, with 10 per cent more popular support than the NDP, have a more legitimate claim to the title of government-in-waiting, but a stubborn majority of voters seems to be "ABC" -- Anything But Conservative. Most Liberal, NDP and Bloq Québécois voters do not list the Conservative party as their second choice. The biggest factor keeping the Liberals in power is that their main opposition is one Canadians see as an even bigger threat to the country.
The Conservative response to this reality is disappointing. The self-proclaimed party of individual responsibility blames everybody but itself for its failure to attract Liberal voters or win back the 850,000 Alliance and Progressive Conservative voters who have left since the two parties merged.
Instead of articulating why its values and policies are desirable, the Tories rely on attacking those who disagree with them and claim Western victimization when polls show their party is stalled in Ontario.
In the Stronach saga, a pitiful episode for all sides, the Conservatives reached new highs in lows as their MPs labelled her a "whore" and "prostitute." Leader Stephen Harper showed more spit than polish by joining the personal jab-fest.
The claim that "she wasn't one of us" is quite disconcerting for a party with pretensions of reaching out to all Canadians. That Belinda, an outspoken advocate of massive tax cuts, the Iraq war and deeper economic and military integration with the U.S., was deemed insufficiently True Blue -- a condemnation heard long before her defection -- raises real concern about how lock-step with all things "right" one must be to be considered a "real" Conservative in the new party.
If Ms. Stronach, with her money, connections, media celebrity and role in founding the merged party, was marginalized and left powerless to move the Tories to the middle on social issues, what hope is there that Joe and Jane Canadian can? That Tories responded to her defection with venom instead of virtue by promoting their party as a home for moderates is unseemly for a would-be government. And just as unseemly is the rapidity with which the old Reform cry of regional victimization was voiced to explain their own failures east of the Manitoba border.
The Tories and their myth-making media friends would have us believe that a million Ontario voters are really (secretly?) saying the following:
"I agree with Stephen Harper that we should have lower taxes than the U.S. because I envy the $8-trillion American debt, and fondly recall the record deficit Mike Harris left here in Ontario. I also supported sending Canadian troops to Iraq and joining U.S. missile defence because they are our friends. I oppose Kyoto because it does too little to protect our environment, and so we should do even less. A firewall around every province and sovereignty-association for all, I say. Oh, there are so many reasons why I want to vote Tory.
"But, hold on, they're mostly westerners. I'm voting Liberal."
The above absurdity is what many Conservatives eerily seem to believe -- that Canadians really do like their values, and only anti-Western bigotry keeps those east of Manitoba from voting for them.
But, wait a second, even most of those west of the Ontario border don't vote Tory. In the 2004 election, 61 per cent of Manitobans, 58 per cent of Saskatchewanians and 64 per cent of British Columbians rejected the Conservatives.
The difference between support for the Tories in Ontario and Manitoba was a whopping seven per cent. There is no sharp division of support for the Tories at the Ontario-Manitoba border. Rather, the difference in seat totals is due to the unhealthy distortions caused by our antiquated first-past-the-post voting system.
In most western urban areas, there is less Tory support than in Ontario. In the average Winnipeg riding, 72 per cent did not vote Tory. In Regina and Saskatoon, it was 64 per cent. In Vancouver, 80 per cent. In Victoria, 78 per cent. Clearly, Belinda isn't alone in thinking the Tories aren't adequately addressing urban concerns.
So, according to the Conservative line, the majority of westerners are anti-western? Gullibly brain-washed by "eastern" media? Or are there, gasp, substantive reasons to oppose a Conservative government? Until Mr. Harper can convert Canadians to his vision on the core issues, or accomplishes the even harder task of convincing Canadians that he and his party have sincerely changed their core convictions, most will not want the Tories to govern our land.
Which gets us back to the original problem -- the need for an alternative to the Liberals that Canadians might embrace. Sorry as the soap-opera around the Stronach defection is, the more serious and sadder reality is that it underscores how truly unpalatable our current political options are.
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/westview/story/2814078p-3258297c.html
unsnipped<
of course the ndp still do not count
cheers :) majere
snipped>
Sun May 29 2005
By DALE SWIRSKY
NOT since the deadlocked sectarian divisions of the 1860s have Canadians faced a political situation as unhealthy as the current one.
In short, we have a government we do not want, and opposition parties that we want even less.
Without question, the Liberals merit punishment at the polls. They have not paid for their sins, and continue to sin by operating in the belief that power can be purchased.
But while Canadians are painfully aware that the Liberals are damaging Canada, they fear the two main opposition groups would harm it even more. Canadians are showing great restraint and wisdom in not punishing Canada (ie. themselves) for Liberal transgressions. History is filled with societies which, in the understandable desire to toss out incompetent governments, turned to worse alternatives, with predictably sad consequences.
The NDP has acquitted itself well in the current "rage TV" parliamentary session. It avoided mudslinging and negotiated more resources for the homeless, post-secondary education, and the environment. Critics howled about a "drunken-sailor spending spree", but the reality is that most Canadians support these measures, and the cost is a mere 0.45 per cent of the budget -- the equivalent of my wife and I spending $13.50 more than our usual $3,000 in monthly expenses. If drunken sailors (who are not to be confused with my wife and I) spent more helping the homeless, education and the environment, what a wonderful world it would be!
Still, while the NDP deserves credit for working to have Parliament work, its anti-business and anti-American tendencies cause many Canadians to eschew it as a potential government. That so many Canadians would never consider voting NDP helps maintain Liberal power. The Conservatives, with 10 per cent more popular support than the NDP, have a more legitimate claim to the title of government-in-waiting, but a stubborn majority of voters seems to be "ABC" -- Anything But Conservative. Most Liberal, NDP and Bloq Québécois voters do not list the Conservative party as their second choice. The biggest factor keeping the Liberals in power is that their main opposition is one Canadians see as an even bigger threat to the country.
The Conservative response to this reality is disappointing. The self-proclaimed party of individual responsibility blames everybody but itself for its failure to attract Liberal voters or win back the 850,000 Alliance and Progressive Conservative voters who have left since the two parties merged.
Instead of articulating why its values and policies are desirable, the Tories rely on attacking those who disagree with them and claim Western victimization when polls show their party is stalled in Ontario.
In the Stronach saga, a pitiful episode for all sides, the Conservatives reached new highs in lows as their MPs labelled her a "whore" and "prostitute." Leader Stephen Harper showed more spit than polish by joining the personal jab-fest.
The claim that "she wasn't one of us" is quite disconcerting for a party with pretensions of reaching out to all Canadians. That Belinda, an outspoken advocate of massive tax cuts, the Iraq war and deeper economic and military integration with the U.S., was deemed insufficiently True Blue -- a condemnation heard long before her defection -- raises real concern about how lock-step with all things "right" one must be to be considered a "real" Conservative in the new party.
If Ms. Stronach, with her money, connections, media celebrity and role in founding the merged party, was marginalized and left powerless to move the Tories to the middle on social issues, what hope is there that Joe and Jane Canadian can? That Tories responded to her defection with venom instead of virtue by promoting their party as a home for moderates is unseemly for a would-be government. And just as unseemly is the rapidity with which the old Reform cry of regional victimization was voiced to explain their own failures east of the Manitoba border.
The Tories and their myth-making media friends would have us believe that a million Ontario voters are really (secretly?) saying the following:
"I agree with Stephen Harper that we should have lower taxes than the U.S. because I envy the $8-trillion American debt, and fondly recall the record deficit Mike Harris left here in Ontario. I also supported sending Canadian troops to Iraq and joining U.S. missile defence because they are our friends. I oppose Kyoto because it does too little to protect our environment, and so we should do even less. A firewall around every province and sovereignty-association for all, I say. Oh, there are so many reasons why I want to vote Tory.
"But, hold on, they're mostly westerners. I'm voting Liberal."
The above absurdity is what many Conservatives eerily seem to believe -- that Canadians really do like their values, and only anti-Western bigotry keeps those east of Manitoba from voting for them.
But, wait a second, even most of those west of the Ontario border don't vote Tory. In the 2004 election, 61 per cent of Manitobans, 58 per cent of Saskatchewanians and 64 per cent of British Columbians rejected the Conservatives.
The difference between support for the Tories in Ontario and Manitoba was a whopping seven per cent. There is no sharp division of support for the Tories at the Ontario-Manitoba border. Rather, the difference in seat totals is due to the unhealthy distortions caused by our antiquated first-past-the-post voting system.
In most western urban areas, there is less Tory support than in Ontario. In the average Winnipeg riding, 72 per cent did not vote Tory. In Regina and Saskatoon, it was 64 per cent. In Vancouver, 80 per cent. In Victoria, 78 per cent. Clearly, Belinda isn't alone in thinking the Tories aren't adequately addressing urban concerns.
So, according to the Conservative line, the majority of westerners are anti-western? Gullibly brain-washed by "eastern" media? Or are there, gasp, substantive reasons to oppose a Conservative government? Until Mr. Harper can convert Canadians to his vision on the core issues, or accomplishes the even harder task of convincing Canadians that he and his party have sincerely changed their core convictions, most will not want the Tories to govern our land.
Which gets us back to the original problem -- the need for an alternative to the Liberals that Canadians might embrace. Sorry as the soap-opera around the Stronach defection is, the more serious and sadder reality is that it underscores how truly unpalatable our current political options are.
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/westview/story/2814078p-3258297c.html
unsnipped<
of course the ndp still do not count
